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Official New Post-processing Stack (Pre-Release)

Discussion in 'Image Effects' started by Chman, Oct 10, 2016.

  1. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    I have encountered an issue with the current fog implementation. It seems like the fog from the post fx stack takes "ownership" of the fog setting in the scene lighting tab. The problem is, that I was still using the old global fog effect because it had more features, and I use transparent shaders without fog implementation, and had the global fog effect hacked to be drawn after transparent instead of before. Now I need to turn off the fog in the stack to not have two stacked fog effects, but a third asset I'm using reads the fog settings from the scene tab, and now I can't enable those because they are tied to the fog setting of the stack. I'd be OK with the stack telling me "hey, make sure you enable/disable the scene fog settings too, to match this setting", but the way it is implemented now I'm having a problem that I wouldn't know how to solve. If it was just one effect script like before I could probably hack it myself, but the whole stack has so many scripts I wouldn't know where to start looking and I'd also prefer not to have to re-hack this after every update. In my humble opinion it would be better to change the behaviour of the stack locking the scene fog settings, or at least make it optional and add a warning there that you need to take care of setting it correctly yourself when you override the automatic synchronization of the settings. That would probably the best way, to maintain ease of use for people with less exotic usecases than mine.

    When I activate dithering I get an upleasant animated grain effect and also a slight but unpleasant brightness flickering. Since dither has no settings to tweak, I wonder if that is a bug. I remember the dither from a way way earlier iteration of the stack to work well and have no visual "motion". The way this is now I don't see why I would want to use it. But I'm not missing it either, I use a non-animated (would love that option in the stack) grain from colorful-fx to combat the colorbanding that my retro pixel effect causes.

    Now that I tested again, I noticed when I have chromatic aberration on, the grain effect disappears entirely, and when I have it off, the grain has brightness flickering as well. So maybe that's somehow connected to the issue with the dithering?

    And when the grain is active (no matter if visible or not due to the bug with the chromatic aberration setting) the vignette is forced on, disregarding its on/off setting.

    Apart from that I really love the post fx stack! It has completely replaced Scion for me and I'm not looking back!
     
  2. joshua-lyness

    joshua-lyness

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    Im not sure what is going on with this, but I can barely use half the effects. Most of them turn my camera completely pink (the shader error color), which isnt really the effect im going for. Any ideas?

    it should be ready to view shortly, i know vimeo can sometimes take a while
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2017
  3. Baldinoboy

    Baldinoboy

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    Try re-importing the PostProcess folder but right clicking on it and select reimport. That is what helped me when the same was happening.
     
  4. FPires

    FPires

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    I just realized that the dithering uses blue noise. The implementation is pretty good!
     
  5. Johannski

    Johannski

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    This is due to the downsampling of the screen by half before applying the first bloom pass.There is no setting that controls that, you would need to dig into code to change it. You will find a comment there that half the size is feasible, which it mostly is. Applying a blur on the full screen size costs quite some performance, I guess that's why they chose to downsample it once before applying a blur.

    As for your second question: Hm, not quite sure if you can achieve that without modifying any code, but what you're asking for does not sound like it would not be visible with the real sun either.
     
  6. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    Thanks, I will investigate that. But what we have at the moment isn't usable for anyone, is it? I mean, it's impossible to get a bloom that doesn't wobble with the current version of the asset. I've tried all render modes and a ton of different sizes and settings for the bloom. It's extremely noticeable. And does this mean other bloom assets like Sonic Ether's and Paroxe's or even the old Unity blooms all have fullscreen blurs? They aren't expensive at all. If so I strongly feel this should be a setting in the inspector for the bloom asset so we can choose ourselves what we want.

    As for my second question it's so hard to tell how the real sun looks because it's so bright, and that annoys me a lot. :p Also I use glasses so I don't know how it would look for a "normal" person. My perfectionist OCD is annoyed by this fact every day because to recreate an effect you need to know what you're trying to recreate and I'm unable to stare at the sun long enough to accurately tell how it looks, and even if I could, I don't know what I see is how it would look for other people. :p The only thing I do know is that i don't want to recreate the look of taking a picture of the sun or filming the sun because I don't want games where it feels like you're looking through a camera. I know this is what every single AAA game does and has always done, but I don't like it. Even if my alternative isn't feasible, I will still try to reach for it. :)

    One thing that happens in real life with extremely bright lights (at least for me :p) is that they become so bright that they get cyan/pink hues rather than pure white, and they show an effect that looks almost like the laggy burn-in effect you got on old televisions. This is probably due to burn-in on my retina or something like that. So it doesn't look correct for me for something to just be clipped to white in a game when it's super bright. I want some way to highlight the fact that my sun disc is even brighter than the surrounding glow, but I have no idea how I would accomplish that in Unity or in a game in general. This did give me an idea though. I know I've seen "old television" image effects which has an effect similar to what I'm thinking of.

    Edit: This is what I'm thinking of:


    "Phosphor Trail Effect". To me this looks very similar to the effect I get when looking at something extremely bright, the only difference is that rather than red it's cyan/pink or something similar to that.
     
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2017
  7. chingwa

    chingwa

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    It's round. :)
     
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  8. hippocoder

    hippocoder

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    And bright.
     
  9. Chman

    Chman

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    Definitely not a known issue. I'll look into it, if I can repro it.
    Looks like you're getting NaNs... Could be from your custom shader, could be from our stack. Any chance you could send me a repro-project? Also: what Unity version is that? Target platform? API (DX, OpenGL, Metal...)?
    Known issue with 5.5.
    We're working on a solution to animate post-processing effects easily but in the meantime you can look at this. As for lerping LUTs directly, one way would be to blend both LUT textures yourself and send it to the stack. Not ideal, I know. But we have something sweet coming :)
    So, eye adaptation... We have an update coming for this effect (currently being reviewed), I made the UI easier to use and switched to proper EV units. As for your example, when setup correctly the effect should be what you expect: looking directly at the sun would make everything darker and going in a dark cave it would brighten up. Here's a quick, exaggerated gif that shows this behavior.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2017
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  10. Chman

    Chman

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    It is already, in a way that makes sense. "Eye adaptation" only tweak the exposure before bloom & tonemapping kick in. So it'll have an effect on both effects. Not sure what you mean by "combined" in this case.
    I'm curious, what are your bloom settings?
    A fix is coming to the asset store for this specific issue. Or you can get it right away on Github :)
    You mean, like in real life when you look directly at the sun? :D In your video, bloom is so strong that it's white. I can't see how you'd draw a brighter object on top of pure white. You probably want to tweak the exposure or sun & bloom strength. But overall your video looks good to me, just too strong. This is arguably more realistic than showing a sun disk on top.
    We just changed it to make it a lot less painful. Expect an update on the store soon, or grab it from Github.
    Dithering doesn't have any setting, it's not a bug. What may be a bug is the flickering brightness... Also, you shouldn't be able to actually see the dithering in motion. Something's wrong here. Would you happen to have a repro-project for us to look at?
    I can't reproduce these at all on the current master.
     
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  11. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    My project is over 3 gigs big :-/. I'll grab the new version from git and test if it persists. If it does I'll try to get a smaller repro together.

    p.s.:
    I didn't mean that it has no settings seemed wrong, I just meant the flickering.
     
  12. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    Did you check out the phosphor trail effect video? :p But yeah, you're right, I'm not even sure what I'm asking. I just thought that some way of simulating bright lights burning themselves into your retina (if that's the term... cornea perhaps?) and then retaining that burn-in as you turn the camera around similar to motion blur would kick ass. But it may just be a matter of lack of dynamic range when it comes to both software and hardware when compared to the real thing.

    I will post an example project showing the bloom wobble with various settings. I'm unable to choose settings where it doesn't happen, even in a new project.

    And with the eye adaption, I think part of my problem is that my sun without bloom isn't very big so perhaps the eye adaption doesn't recognize looking at the sun as being particularly bright. I'm currently focusing more on completing my scene before I fiddle more with post processing, but I will investigate all of this in more detail later on.
     
  13. flashframe

    flashframe

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    Sounds great, thank you. Do you have a ballpark timeframe for this? Is it days, weeks or months away? Just trying to gauge whether I should finish writing my own animation methods or hold out for the new features :)
     
  14. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    @Chman Here's a project reproducing the wobbling bloom. If you want me to use a more proper channel to report this just say so.

    It's 3 example scenes with a camera which you can rotate using the mouse. They should be clearly labeled. In one scene I haven't touched a single setting and the wobble is still very visible in my opinion, in the other two scenes I've made it more and less visible, but it's clearly visible in all 3 scenes and there's no way to get rid of it except maybe dive into the code as was noted by @Johannski.

    Turning on temporal anti-aliasing, dithering or the anti-flicker setting for the bloom makes no difference.

    I deleted the Textures folder from the asset just because I wasn't using it and because it's 99% of the size. :p

    Like I said I'm unable to make a bloom that doesn't appear to be dancing when you move the camera with this asset.
     

    Attached Files:

  15. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    Quick question. Is this how I would change anti-aliasing method through script?
    Code (CSharp):
    1. if (value == 2) {
    2.     cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing.enabled = true;
    3.     AntialiasingModel.Settings tempSettings = cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing.settings;
    4.     tempSettings.method = AntialiasingModel.Method.Taa;
    5.     cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing.settings = tempSettings;
    6. }
    7. else if (value == 1) {
    8.     cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing.enabled = true;
    9.     AntialiasingModel.Settings tempSettings = cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing.settings;
    10.     tempSettings.method = AntialiasingModel.Method.Fxaa;
    11.     cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing.settings = tempSettings;
    12. }
    13. else {
    14.     cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing.enabled = false;
    15. }
    It's working, but it just seems a bit convoluted to me, but then again I'm not familiar with "proper" code. :p

    Also, related to the same thing. I found an example of how to access the PostProcessingBehaviour through script, but in that example the profile was duplicated like this before changing anything:
    Code (CSharp):
    1. var behaviour = GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>();
    2. m_Profile = Instantiate(behaviour.profile);
    3. behaviour.profile = m_Profile;
    This doesn't seem to be necessary, although I realize that I change the asset itself doing it my way. But if I want my settings to be saved or if I reset everything through script when I start the scene anyway does it matter?
     
  16. ivanmotta

    ivanmotta

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    Just downloaded, and TAA is butter sweet again! Thanks!
     
  17. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    @Chman: It seems the updated version no longer has the main issues (chromatic aberration, grain and vignette settings). Awesome! :)
    I could only see a faint hint of flickering on the dithering now, but only in certain situations and maybe I'm just imagining it. I'll keep an eye out if I see it happen again in a clearly reproducable way.
    Thanks!
     
  18. Chman

    Chman

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    Yeah I did check it, I'm familiar with the effect :) It's a very specific effect and won't make it to the stack in its current form though. Also, I know it's subjective but at some point you have to decide if you want to emulate an eye or a camera sensor + lens. Most of what we do leans toward the camera side, as it's what most people expect. And we're about to go even further into lens emulation, stay tuned!
    Current target is Unity 2017.1 (next version after 5.6).
    Thanks, we'll take a look!
    You should cache cam.GetComponent<PostProcessingBehaviour>().profile.antialiasing once, it would simplify your code a lot and make it faster as well.
    Nope, it's fine :)
    Good to know!
     
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  19. JakubSmaga

    JakubSmaga

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  20. Chman

    Chman

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  21. flashframe

    flashframe

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    @Chman Is there a way to export the generated LUT from the Color Grading component? I tried using ReadPixels() on the model.bakedLut render texture, and saved it out as a file. But if I use that as an LUT I don't get the same look.

    The reason I'd like to do this is so that we can dial in the look we want using the color grading tools and then save the LUT out (so I can blend them at runtime - once I've worked out how to do that...!)
     
  22. Chman

    Chman

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    No, you shouldn't export the internal LUT. Grading is done in HDR, so the LUT is encoded in log space (and tonemapping is baked in it as well). You won't be able to feed it back as the LUT field in the stack expects a linear-space LUT and applies it in LDR. We want to give the ability to feed a custom log LUT in future versions, but this will require a specific setup and good grading tools (like DaVinci Resolve, don't expect Photoshop to be of much use there).

    If all you want is to animate color grading values you can animate grading settings directly. Exporting the LUT wouldn't be of any use, really, because generating the internal LUT is very fast, fast enough to work fine on low end mobile hardware. It is meant to be generated in real-time, it's not a "bake and play" setup.
     
  23. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    Thanks for the reply and for the update.

    Although I think this is an awesome asset I will complain (critique?) some more.

    It is my understanding that you, @Chman, made SSAO Pro. I'm comparing SSAO Pro and the ambient occlusion included with this asset in my project at the moment and in my opinion SSAO Pro blows this asset out of the water in every regard. The only metric I don't test is performance because I usually have the luxury of being able to ignore that, at least to some extent. I just want the best possible end result.

    SSAO Pro looks like baked ambient occlusion, plain and simple. It's rock solid, consistent, never moves, never looks noisy, and you can crank up the detail and turn down the radius enough that it shows up everywhere, even between the grains of sand in a texture. I'm not able to get similar results with the ambient occlusion included here. Is it a work in progress or is it just a compromise towards performance?

    Is it just a matter of exposing more variables for me to play with in the inspector or is this a completely different technique with it's own pros and cons?

    I feel like it objectively looks a lot worse and I'm curious as to what you or other people think.

    Although I would like more settings exposed for me to tweak the look of the ambient occlusion, perhaps and the expense of performance, I have 2 key complaints which I immediately noticed when I added it to my project.

    1. SSAO Pro doesn't look like a screen space effect because there's no fading at the edges:

    The images showcase a sofa which extends well past the edge of the screen. On the left is SSAO Pro and on the right is this asset. This asset acts as if it there's nothing past the edge of the screen and fades out the ambient occlusion while SSAO Pro doesn't. This is extremely noticeable in motion. It makes this effect look as if someone is running after you spray painting the ambient occlusion on as you move around the scene. This is huge in my opinion. And it's just as noticeable without the debug view for me.

    2. In SSAO Pro you can set a max distance for the SSAO and within that distance the level of ambient occlusion is consistent at all distances.

    Here's SSAO Pro far away and close up:


    The amount of ambient occlusion visible on the bed in the first image is consistent with the amount of ambient occlusion visible when we move up close.

    Here's this asset far away and close up:


    There's almost no ambient occlusion visible on the bed in the first image, but the closer we get the more ambient occlusion becomes visible. In motion this is jarring to me.

    Combined these effects make this ambient occlusion look very much like it's sloppily painted on top of everything as you move around your scene whereas SSAO Pro looks like it's part of the textures.

    Not to mention the fact that I feel SSAO Pro overall looks a lot nicer. There are a lot of settings to play with in SSAO Pro so I may have it turned up higher than is possible with this asset for all I know.
     
  24. flashframe

    flashframe

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    Ok understood, thanks for the clarification. I was hoping to slightly streamline the animation process by blending LUTs instead of animating all the Color Grading properties, but seems like that requires changes to the shader, so probably best to just stick to using the color grading component and lerping all the values when I need to alter the look at runtime, especially if it's fast. I presumed there would be largish performance impact.

    Thanks!
     
  25. Martin_H

    Martin_H

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    I feel like that most likely depends entirely on the usecase. When I compared SSAO pro to the first version of the cinematic image effects SSAO (not the one from the stack), I liked the new one a lot more. Comparing that one to the first version of the combined stack I liked the one from the stack a tiny bit less and I'm actually really considering stacking both, because they seem to be slightly different and have different strengths. I'm sure SSAO pro is great or maybe even better in certain usecases, in my case I get better look (and I think also better performance) from the implementation in the stack. There will never be a solution that makes everybody equally happy.
    I have to ask though, since you own SSAO pro and apparently don't care that much about performance differences, what's keeping you from just using SSAO pro instead of the SSAO in the stack if you like it more? Just curious.

    @Chman: what I'm considering is duplicating one SSAO effect and putting my own spin on it. Basically I'd want the effect to add light too and do more with colors than just add the typical black shades for shadows. Do you have a recommendation which SSAO effect I should use as a base to start with?
     
  26. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    How would I combine them? Wouldn't it be completely wrong if I use other image effects with the stack because I can't select the order? I haven't actually tried though. :p

    But either way I thought I would mention it because I really dislike the "artifacts" in this ambient occlusion.

    Edit: Nevermind, it seems like SSAO is supposed to be at the very start so I can put it before the stack and it seems to work okay. I also remembered that I have an HBAO asset from an Level 11 sale which also seems to have its own pros and cons. The HBAO asset uses command buffers and claims it doesn't matter where I put it in the component list, it applies itself correctly regardless from what I can tell.

    Both the HBAO asset and SSAO pro has ambient occlusion that feels more baked than the one currently in this asset in my opinion.

    Edit2: The HBAO asset actually has some really neat features and is able to look really nice, but man it can be expensive with everything cranked up. I guess I have an upper limit as to how expensive a single effect should be. :p It's much more expensive than the entire post processing stack.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2017
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  27. bakanekofr

    bakanekofr

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    I'm having an issue with the depth of field effect, dark outlines when there is a high depth contrast, visible on the screenshot attached, especially on the pipe in the blue fog.

    Using the latest GITHub version.

    dof_bug.png
     
  28. BKprod

    BKprod

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    Ah it's indeed very nice to have those effects stacked in a process file. Good job !
    It might be cool to be able to add an delete effects from the stack.

    I did noticed something with SSR :
    Blending of reflections on low smoothness surfaces are a bit sharp. I mean, smoothness values from 0 to 0.15 doesn't have reflection at all, and appears suddenly at 0.16.
    Maybe it has anything to do with gamma or linear rendering ?



    Tweaking screen edges or fresnel fade doesn't fix it.
    Is there any way in the code or something to have less "abrupt" blending ?
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2017
  29. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    For anyone interested I updated my in-game settings menu project to version 2 and with that I replaced all the old image effects with the new post processing stack showing how to control it from script:
    http://twiik.net/projects/in-game-settings-menu

    I made a video showing it off as well:


    The post processing stack and the corridor asset makes the project look amazing imo. :p
     
  30. chelnok

    chelnok

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    Thanks alot @TwiiK ! This is really helpful to get to know all the effects, and to get better idea about performance cost. This was actually first time i tried pp-stack in build, i've only tried some twiiking in editor. And thanks for sharing the project! I just need to update unity to 5.5.2f1 first, but i'm going to add fps counter and character controller.

    Cool menu too, is it okay to use it in my own projects? ..without dckbut :)
     
  31. TwiiK

    TwiiK

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    @chelnok Go nuts. :p I impose no restrictions on the use of most of my projects, but I have a README-file in all my projects where there's information about the project.
     
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  32. Lars-Steenhoff

    Lars-Steenhoff

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    Please please make trigger volumes.

    Must have for a stack like this :cool:
     
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  33. Ikaruga7

    Ikaruga7

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    Just downloaded v1.01 from the asset store. DOF appears to make objects black when the F-stop is small.
    upload_2017-3-22_20-31-28.png
     
  34. UnityLighting

    UnityLighting

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    This package need Lens Flare effect similar to UE4 bloom or Cry Engine 2+. Please add this feature
     
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  35. UnityLighting

    UnityLighting

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  36. UnityLighting

    UnityLighting

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    Last edited: Mar 25, 2017
  37. UnityLighting

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  38. ReniTheGhost

    ReniTheGhost

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    Hello!
    I'm trying to do the following.
    First camera Clear flag: Skybox, Clipping plane: 40-100, Depth: 0, HDR: true.
    Second camera Clear flag: depth only, Clipping plane: 0.1f-40, Depth: 1, HDR: ture, Image Effects attached.
    I tryed this with menu project 2.0 but it also not worked.
    I need this trick in my game, so please help me how can i solve this problem?
     
  39. Jesus

    Jesus

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    I've been having a bit of trouble with this myself. There's another thread that sort of has the same problem, here:
    https://forum.unity3d.com/threads/d...-ssao-bugged-ufps-onrenderimage.198632/page-2

    The main issue seems to be that you can't have a 'far' camera that is HDR. It seems that as soon as it's outputting HDR, that breaks it.

    One bad workaround I've found is to make the far camera tonemapped into LDR space (non-HDR). Of course, that means if you want to use tonemapping on anything the 'near' camera will see, then the distant stuff will get tonemapped twice and go gray and desaturated a fair bit, and there WILL be a visible seam at the far plane of the near camera.

    I've heard rumblings about there being some sort of camera and rendertexture refactor in 5.6 (???) which should release in a few days, I'm not sure though.
     
  40. ReniTheGhost

    ReniTheGhost

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    Thanks, MultiCameraImageEffectFix script seems to be sovled my problem.It's cost a lots of fps but until a unity fix this will work fine.
     
  41. Petethegoat

    Petethegoat

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    Hi, just writing in to say I also get the wobbling bloom effect that Twiik described, on 1.0.1, with default settings, and with every combination of settings I've tried.
     
  42. hippocoder

    hippocoder

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    Having fog parameters in 2 different places (lighting tab and post) is not intelligent or intuitive for all users, can it be changed? Everyone knows fog is a post effect, and will be wanting to change it in one place.

    If you will be wanting to keep it for vertex shading, then you should make that separate entirely from post effect ie "Vertex Fog" settings somewhere else entirely, perhaps under a new legacy rendering menu option?
     
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2017
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  43. semaphore

    semaphore

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    Hello,

    Is there a way to disable showing the Post Processing Stack effects in the scene view and restricting that only to game view?

    It makes things really slow the way it is currently.
     
  44. UnityLighting

    UnityLighting

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    Untitled.jpg
     
    Adam-Bailey likes this.
  45. AlanMattano

    AlanMattano

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2013
    Posts:
    1,501
    @Chman A performance drop activating each post process effect expose in the inspector can be handy for game developers and players. So that we can let the user know how much fps or percentage performance is losing activating each post process component and let the player make his own decision in function of his hardware.
     
  46. semaphore

    semaphore

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Posts:
    49
  47. UnityLighting

    UnityLighting

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  48. semaphore

    semaphore

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2011
    Posts:
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    I know :)

    The questions are for the developers.
     
  49. UnityLighting

    UnityLighting

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    You need to ask these features from unity developers.
     
  50. Bravo_cr

    Bravo_cr

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2012
    Posts:
    148
    Hi there,

    We are using the post process stack in a camera that creates a render texture to be used as a thumbnail (imagine the typical RPG inventory where you take a snapshot of the objects). The problems is that only AO maintains the alpha of the image correctly. Antialiasing breaks in in a really strange manner, an all of the other postFX just fills the alpha. Could you please maintain the original alpha and not override it when no needed?