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The "I have one piece of advice to give" Post!

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by DanglinBob, May 28, 2015.

  1. DanglinBob

    DanglinBob

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    This came up recently in a chat with my producer, and it was, if I had only one short piece of advice to give about game development, what would it be?

    Now it was not stated that this advice should be to novices, and I've been working in games for a long time, but one answer just immediately came to me... and it's pretty simple and crosses all skill boundaries.

    "Don't make a mobile game."

    Don't lynch me yet :) Let me explain! We all want to be the next King or Rovio, but the reality is in terms of risk to reward chances mobile is the worst bet you could play. PC & Console just have it beat hands down... Yes, typically both development time and budget are slightly higher, but the odds of breaking even/having a big hit are just mountains higher.

    There's a lot of reasons for this, but the primary one is you have almost no control over promotion (unless your product has an average revenue high enough for scalable advertising, which is incredibly difficult).

    This is my advice. There's no shortage of examples of success on mobile, nor examples of failures, but all things equal going to mobile first is unnecessarily risky.

    There is ONE exception to this: If you plan on failure. This is especially true of beginners, where financial success just isn't the primary goal. When experience and getting published products is your goal, the lower cost and difficulty of publishing a mobile game is simply superior... not to mention since failure is expected on mobile nobody will bat an eye at the fact your first game didn't sell enough to buy pizza with! You release on console with results like that and it's a different story!

    I'd love to hear what other developers have to say if they could offer one piece of quality advice and their reasoning for it. Toss in your level of experience (I've got 12 years) so we have an idea of where you're coming from too!
     
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  2. KingMatthew

    KingMatthew

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    Lighting plays a huge part in the graphical fidelity of a game. It can make any game look beautiful.

    I have been using unity for about 2 years now. I have loved every second of it.
     
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  3. imaginaryhuman

    imaginaryhuman

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    If you need to listen to other people's advice, then you don't have what it takes to be a pioneer anyway.
     
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  4. JamesLeeNZ

    JamesLeeNZ

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    Start Small.
     
  5. DanglinBob

    DanglinBob

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    @imaginaryhuman Heh, I've played enough Oregon Trail to know not listening to advice gets you stranded in the Rockies dying of snake bites. Dang mountain snakes!
     
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  6. DanglinBob

    DanglinBob

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    @KingMatthew & @JamesLeeNZ - Both solid pieces of advice (Start small being a very common one we toss around, but I hadn't considered the importance of lighting... not really my thing... so excellent!)
     
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  7. jpthek9

    jpthek9

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    That's some arrogant crap.
     
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  8. ANTMAN0079

    ANTMAN0079

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    Quit while you're getting nowhere.
     
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  9. angrypenguin

    angrypenguin

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    Learn each aspect of your craft in its own right. That is, don't learn "game development" and don't "learn Unity", learn programming or art or whatever your desired field is and then apply that to game development.
     
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  10. Batman_831

    Batman_831

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    Logic in your game is more important than graphics, your game should be interesting to play, graphics don't matter as long as your game is interesting !


    This is something i've noticed. As for example, there are many games which are very interesting but they lack in graphics, best example i can think of is Minecraft.
     
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  11. jpthek9

    jpthek9

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    Graphics aren't very significant but unified aesthetics are. Looking at MineCraft, you should notice how the aesthetics immerse you in a blocky world and don't let you go. They convince you that the world is real, even if only subconsciously.

    Every successful game, whether it be TF2 or Flappy Birds, has unified aesthetics that work together to convince the player that the world he or she is embracing isn't just a combination of pixels and numbers. For video games, this is extremely important because the minute the player sees the game trivially, the game becomes just a game and no more.

    Painters discovered this fact long ago. Sure, detail is important to make your work stand out but if your work doesn't consistently convey the same world, the viewer can't take your work seriously with or without 4K resolution.

    With video games, there are many other pieces to this puzzle of immersing players. Taking MineCraft as an example, every sound, graphic, and mechanic seems to all come from the same silly, blocky world. Interestingly, making the graphics or sounds of the game more realistic would actually make the game much worse.
     
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  12. NomadKing

    NomadKing

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    Take a 10 minute walk and come back to it.
     
  13. zombiegorilla

    zombiegorilla

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    Also, take up smoking. It is a great way to have a reason to step a way from the computer, and if you work in a large company, it is great chance to soundboard challenges you are having with other smokers.

    (just kidding, don't smoke, but if you do, try to make it productive)
     
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  14. zombiegorilla

    zombiegorilla

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    I am going to kinda back this one. You can never win by following, and this industry is so young and erratic, that there are few "experts" in game design/marketing. Most people telling you how to do to it, have never really done it in the first place. And there is plenty of space to carve out your niche based on your methods and desires. If you want to build an MMO, F***ing do it. You'll either realize the difficulty, and start over with a better understanding, or realize games aren't for you, or actually achieve it through force of will. (everyone should read the dev thread on Kinetic Damage).
     
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  15. ostrich160

    ostrich160

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    Graphics should never be considered unimportant, even if your game is more focused on gameplay, your graphics should still be good even if they arent high fidelity

    Slightly? Either your new to mobile development or new to PC development, because a PC game will typically take me a couple of months to get the graphics and basic mechanics down, in that time my mobile game is finished.
     
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  16. Kiwasi

    Kiwasi

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    Pioneers do need a healthy dose of arrogance. Good advice.

    The entire civ series.
     
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  17. hippocoder

    hippocoder

    Digital Ape

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    My tip:

    Successful people only give you out of date info or info harmless to them.
     
  18. FuzzyQuills

    FuzzyQuills

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    Yep! :) I've played a couple of the older ones from the win98 days... Good times! :)

    Dare I say it: (nearly) every N64 Game ever made! :D
     
  19. DallonF

    DallonF

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    Disagree here. N64 games had stunning graphics when they were released, and since have become very dated-looking. (Notice that nobody's* making N64-style retro indie games, while 8-bit and 16-bit styles are very popular)

    But they're fun, and the brilliant design makes it easy to look past the dated graphics, and I think that's the point you're trying to make anyways!

    *the world's a big place, so probably somebody, but it's a small number
     
  20. frosted

    frosted

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    It's true. Ignore their advice it's all useless. Just steal every last one of their ideas. Stealin' ideas, that the absolutely most important part of being a good game design / dev.
     
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  21. ippdev

    ippdev

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    And it is proven that nicotine improve neural transport in the brain by 75%. Could be why the gubmnt wants you to stop smoking "for your health" whilst OK-ing Monsanto crap and noxious food additives.
     
  22. Devil_Inside

    Devil_Inside

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    Learn to use google search
     
  23. DallonF

    DallonF

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    Actually, that's partially true. Which leads me to My One Piece of Advice:

    Don't try to be original. You won't succeed. It's much better to identify your influences and learn from them.
     
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  24. frosted

    frosted

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    lol, I wasn't kidding at all. Steal all their ideas. Seriously, stealing ideas is the most important part of good design.
     
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  25. randomperson42

    randomperson42

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    If nobody ever tried to be original, every game would be the same.
     
  26. frosted

    frosted

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    Nothing comes from nothing. Creativity is mixing in a bunch of things you've seen before in a way thats hopefully novel.

    Personally I like calling it stealing, it feels more honest than 'inspiration'!
     
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  27. sluice

    sluice

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    KISS
    Keep it Simple Stupid

    IID
    Incremental & Iterative Development

    RERO
    Release Early Release Often

    TMTOWTDI
    There's More Than One Way To Do It

    DRY
    Don't Repeat yourself

    DDAD
    Don't Drink & Drive
     
  28. Gigiwoo

    Gigiwoo

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    One piece of advice? "Finish"

    Gigi
     
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  29. Tiles

    Tiles

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    Do it!
     
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  30. KingMatthew

    KingMatthew

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    This.
    You would be surprised how many people don't know how to do this.
     
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  31. tiggus

    tiggus

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    If you're not excited about playing your game no one else will be either.
     
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  32. jpthek9

    jpthek9

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    This might be the best and most universal piece of advice for everything.
     
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  33. DanglinBob

    DanglinBob

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    I think @NomadKing may be winning on best piece of advice :D Not that there's a winner or looser here... but yeah, that's better than mine even.
     
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  34. DanglinBob

    DanglinBob

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    Well, slightly is relative. To me taking 6 months vs. taking 1 year is slightly. Even 6m vs. 1.5 years is possibly a slightly longer time to me. In my experience most mobile games I've worked with (and there's quite a few of them, including at least 1 big hit) take much longer than you'd expect. It's pretty common for me to run into games that took 1year+ for mobile... and from what I have seen of the PC games I work with they have roughly the same time horizon. This is in part, lately, due to the prevalence of Early Access, which is letting PC games release much sooner than an iOS counterpart could.

    Anywho - I don't mind a dissenting view! The argument that you should be able to produce mobile games in a fraction of the time it takes a PC game is perfectly valid. Just in my experience it never seems to work out like that.

    (Edit: And yes I realize 6m vs 1.5 years means you're releasing 3x the number of games, I still say your chances of making more from those 3 games is lower than the 1 other game in that time frame)
     
  35. jpthek9

    jpthek9

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    No. Creativity is mixing in a bunch of things you've seen in a way that you know is novel, even if only to you.

    You like to call inspiration stealing? Might as well give both words a good connotation because without inspiration, we wouldn't be having this discussion on the internet. Hell, I doubt we'd even have this language.
     
  36. Kiwasi

    Kiwasi

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    In my day job we call it leveraging. But the principle is the same.

    Trying to produce something completely original is a fools errand. Almost every mechanic has been used before.
     
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  37. Whippets

    Whippets

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    Make Backups. Lots of Backups.
     
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  38. zombiegorilla

    zombiegorilla

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    Ha! An image of a heart broken auto mechanic just popped in my head.
     
  39. Gigiwoo

    Gigiwoo

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    Did you see Dan Cook's article? He's the COO of Indie Studio Spryfox. The article is here: Minimal Sustained Success.

    Gigi
     
  40. Ippokratis

    Ippokratis

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    "Say no to drugs. They do not suffice for all."
    Tzimakos
     
  41. zombiegorilla

    zombiegorilla

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    "Don't buy drugs. Become a pop star, and they give you them for free! "
    Billy Mack
     
  42. Ony

    Ony

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    Don't.

    (source: 20+ years in game development, both AAA and indie)
     
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  43. FuzzyQuills

    FuzzyQuills

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    I actually agree with this; many people still play Mario Kart 64 (me included! :)) for this reason; it's ridiculous, its fun! ;)
    Point being, there was actually a couple of N64 games that somehow managed shadow mapping, so there's that.
    There is one person who does this; ME! :D
     
  44. angrypenguin

    angrypenguin

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    You don't need to be a pioneer in every area, though. I'm perfectly happy to actively follow/learn from those who are more expert than me in their specialist fields as long as there's also a field I can call my own.

    The advice? Don't choose between learning from others and forging your own expertise. Do both.

    Same goes for game design, by the way. I'm more than happy to benefit from the work and knowledge of others for the bulk of a game, and forge my own just for the aspects unique to my game.
     
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  45. landon912

    landon912

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    As negative as this is, I feel like the longer I work in the industry, the closer I get to thinking along these lines.

    Edit: Which oddly enough, this really hurt me to say. It's weird. Making games is my love and passion of my life, but releasing them as commercial enterprises? I don't know. I'm almost 6 years in, and I've got no plans to get out anytime soon. But we will see where I'm at in 10 years.
     
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  46. Ony

    Ony

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    If I could just make games for the hell of it, for the sheer fun of it, and not slowly kill myself in the process, then that would be grand.

    When I was really young I made games on my TRS-80 because I wanted to. For fun. For work I painted signs and cars in my Dad's sign shop. Started airbrushing professionally there when I was 11, and did that (for him and other companies) up until my early 20s, then I got hired to make computer art for a textile company.

    I worked as a digital artist for a few years before getting offered a job at EA, which I thought was awesome at the time (1994) because hell yeah work on games! And I loved it for several years. It was challenging, it was creative, it paid great, the people were fun, it was just an amazing field to be in.

    Later on I decided to branch off and consult\create for other companies but as a freelancer working at home, while I worked on building my own games. I got an insanely lucrative contract right off the bat, creating scenery for a flight simulator, which was for basically two years worth of income for only about 8-9 months work. I was in game developer heaven.

    A year or so after working on that sim (and another) I finally got time to start working on my own games, and got busy. For several years I did pretty well with that, and I also augmented the pay from games with web site development.

    Around 2010 I released a game that made so much money I was just blown away (and I also blew most of it). There was very little competition in the genre of gaming I was developing in, and that really helped. For three years that game totally rocked, and when it finally started petering out I sold it to someone else so they could make some money with it with their own ideas. Then I started on another game. And it took my 6 months to finish. And it tanked. I barely made back what I'd put into it.Then I made another one, which I finished in January and am currently trying to get going, but it too looks like it may tank.

    Competition over these past few years has increased where my game is no longer one of a handful in its genre. Now it's one of many. Making games is much easier these days for anyone who wants to give it a go. The engines are free, the support is plentiful, it's just a thing that regular people do now. And it's great for gaming but it sucks for developers. The money that was shared within a certain pool of very dedicated people is now spread so widely that there's barely anything there unless you have a breakout hit or are a AAA developer. Not to say that modern developers aren't dedicated, don't get me wrong. It's just a different level of dedication.

    So if you read that above you'll notice a common thread running through it: Money.

    My career is making games. I no longer make them because it's fun. I make them because they pay my bills. I've been involved with a ton of them, and I've had a good run. But it's time now to pass the baton to the next generation of developers. I'm 45 years old and I can no longer live on what little these games make nowadays. That sucks, but it's how it is. And everyone making games today, if they stick with it for 20 or so years, will find themselves in a similar position later on. Things change and careers pass on.

    There is an ever expanding pool of developers out there. More games, yes. But much less income per developer for making those games. If you're relying on making games for a living these days, you've got a tough task ahead of you. If you're making them for fun, then awesome, but at some point life intrudes and you have to start making a living.

    I look back now and wish I'd done something else with my life besides sit and stare at a computer screen, slaving away for money and things. But we all make a choice and sometimes we're blind to what that choice might mean down the road.

    I've started painting again (my roots) and writing again (also my roots) and although I am working on and trying to promote my latest game (have to pay the bills, of course), at some point in the near future I plan to sell everything I own and go live in the tropics. Until then I'm right here with the rest of you, cranking away at it. Call me a jaded old veteran if you like, haha. I wish everyone the best of success. :)
     
  47. jpthek9

    jpthek9

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    I think this has a lot to do with the mentality many of us 20-years-younger people have, that games are fun and they make money so why not make games? It seems kind of unethical but discouraging incoming developers or at least not propagating the theory that game deving is a magical wonderland of gold and unicorns would be the best solution to help current developers pay their bills.

    It's kind of like in a zombie apocalypse where resource production stops for the most part. Some people will have to die or get zombified or the entire world will starve. Luckily, it's possible to save many of those dead/zombified people by not dragging them into the apocalyptic world in the first place. Interestingly, this concept is contrary to the "United we stand, divided we fall" theme. United we fall, since there aren't enough resources to support us all, and divided we stand, because there are enough resources to support small groups of us. After all, the VG industry is in the tertiary sector of the market so there's only so much money that can be squeezed out of consumers. Okay, rambling done. Sorry about that.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2015
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  48. goat

    goat

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    My advice - buy and target the cheapest and best available HW that doesn't exceed $200 as no one is all probability is going to buy a device to specifically play your game.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2015
  49. GreenBoxInteractive

    GreenBoxInteractive

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    For beginners like myself, keep your initial scope small.
     
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  50. angrypenguin

    angrypenguin

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    That bolded bit is a pretty huge assumption, and it's one that gets loads of people into trouble. Compare the income of game developers - average ones, not just the (true*) success stories - and the truth of that might not be so shiny and grand as you're thinking. Don't let that discourage you from getting into making games, just be very clear about the difference between doing it as a business or career and doing it as a hobby.

    * I specify the "true" ones because I hear a lot of disaster stories which are presented as success stories.
     
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