After (Fantasy world 2)

Discussion in 'Works In Progress' started by botumys, Feb 5, 2012.

  1. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    Thx Stramit, I'll check the setup with this example. Before, I have to update my version of unit because I'm still using v3.5.0b6.

    ps: if you have some contact with the terrain developers, please, please ask them to add a simple thing : brush value associate to the tool used:

    If the brush radius for painting textures is 5 and I choose a radius of 20 to paint details, it would be great to retrieve to brush radius value set to old value when I return to the painting texture tool, 5.
    I don't know if I am understandable :)
  2. SevenBits

    SevenBits

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    Yes, please!
  3. Chaoss

    Chaoss

    Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2011
    Messages:
    325
    YES.. Web player or Exe
  4. Ricks

    Ricks

    Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2010
    Messages:
    544
    Amazing!
  5. Fishman92

    Fishman92

    Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2010
    Messages:
    2,528
    or dmg.
  6. holyjewsus

    holyjewsus

    Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2011
    Messages:
    587
    I like your site plan
  7. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    Thanks for your friendly comments!
    About a demo, it's a little bit too early. I have to include a lot of objects before to show you something :)
  8. Gigabeat

    Gigabeat

    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2011
    Messages:
    85
    Beautiful work! I'm glad to hear you'll be holding on to this one yourself.
    Your other scene was so beautiful too but just disappeared. :-|

    Good luck~ :)
  9. SevenBits

    SevenBits

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    That's too bad...
  10. aixaix

    aixaix

    Member

    Joined:
    May 7, 2010
    Messages:
    519
    Still, i think all of us will wait.
  11. stefmen

    stefmen

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2009
    Messages:
    755
    great project keep it comming
  12. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    3 new images. I'm fighting with beast lightmapper, one day, it works, and the day after he stops backing without error message :/

    ps: sorry about the bloom, I have to tweak it :)
    ps2: it's wip and I'm actually in a lighting test period. I'll place vegetation later.

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Feb 18, 2012
  13. Avanger

    Avanger

    New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    258
    i have a question this project is for you or you think to sell it?
  14. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
  15. brown2na

    brown2na

    Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2011
    Messages:
    38
    Its good, I really do believe you have some of the best visual landscapes.
  16. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    One new picture.

    Attached Files:

    • $AF1.jpg
      $AF1.jpg
      File size:
      219.9 KB
      Views:
      741
  17. smilefr

    smilefr

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2010
    Messages:
    83
    This looks stunning! Keep up the great work!
  18. lockbox

    lockbox

    Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2012
    Messages:
    495
    Very impressive. You do excellent work! Just awesome!
  19. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
  20. GabrielDrake

    GabrielDrake

    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2012
    Messages:
    20
    beautiful environment effect so far ;)
  21. SevenBits

    SevenBits

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    Pretty nice web player. Runs great in the middle of nowhere but lags when I'm looking at trees... lol.
  22. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    what is your computer SevenBits?
  23. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    Bridge test.

    Attached Files:

    • $AF4.jpg
      $AF4.jpg
      File size:
      252.2 KB
      Views:
      623
    • $AF5.jpg
      $AF5.jpg
      File size:
      296.9 KB
      Views:
      638
    • $AF6.jpg
      $AF6.jpg
      File size:
      274.9 KB
      Views:
      634
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2012
  24. nofosu1

    nofosu1

    New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2011
    Messages:
    73
    Seriously, I know a lot of people have said it already, but your work looks amazing!
  25. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    thx nofosu.
  26. larsbertram1

    larsbertram1

    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2008
    Messages:
    2,314
    hi botumys,

    as far as the webplayer is concerned: it looks like the camera is attached to a dwarf… isn’t it?
    anyway: a very nice start.



    lars
  27. SevenBits

    SevenBits

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    MS Windows 7 64-bit SP1
    Pentium Dual-Core CPU T4300 @ 2.10GHz, 3.0GB RAM, Mobile Intel 4 Series Express Chipset Family

    I have DirectX 11 installed.
  28. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    You right, I have to change scaling of grasses and trees.

    I have a lot of problem with big trees because when they become billboards, the texture resolution is not precise enough and they look ugly.
    About billboards, I encounter the problem of "bad tilting effect". It appears when you have trees on different altitude, tilt value for trees on level x is good (according to camera rotation) but tilt value for trees above are the same and they look deformed.

    I encounter problem for light backing, impossible to bake terrain+trees and objects in the same time, beast crashes at the last pass of GI. I have to bake terrain+ trees, terrain+objects and in photoshop, mix trees shadows and objects shadows for the terrain lightmapping.
    (I have wind 7 64bits and 16Gig of ram)

    And Last point, unity 3.5 is slow when you have trees and vegetation in the view-port. So slow that I have to disable them to change a value
    in the interface (tested on 2 different computer)

    To be honest I'm a bit disappointed about the evolution of unity's terrain tool. Tree editor is great but unfinished and bugged, Terrain tools did not evolved since my first world (I am the only one to think that default values to sculpt are ridiculous, to raise and lower terrain, change opacity more than 10 and you explode your shape.), always the same old brushes, no random value, no rotation. Always the same tools to place trees, not even a little brush to change scale interactively.

    I read that unity will change the terrain system for next version, if it's true, this explain the lack of support for the current one. (3 bugs report without response)
  29. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    Do you have AAA games installed on your computer ? Like The witcher 2, or skyrim ?
    Are they slow?
  30. SevenBits

    SevenBits

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    Most games that have been programmed properly and efficiently use techniques such as light mapping tend to run fine. No, I don't have Skyrim or anything like that installed, because I do all my programming on this computer and games would be a distraction. Even though I make them.

    I typically get bad performance on Unity web players that utilize heavy terrain without any optimizations. I'm not sure why I get fault with yours, but maybe it was a simple little issue. I'll try to run the web player again.
  31. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588

    Do you have some advices about terrain optimizations ? If you have examples of games with large open space, lot of vegetation and running fine and fast for you, please share some sources or screenshots. Can you send me links for badly optimized terrains made with unity, it could be interesting to see where the problem is. In another subject, you told me that 1500/2500 polygons are maybe to high for a
    tree, can you tell my tips about creating trees with build-in tree creator and divide the number of polygons?
  32. SevenBits

    SevenBits

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    I'll try and get around to sending you a PM as to avoid getting off-topic.
  33. larsbertram1

    larsbertram1

    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2008
    Messages:
    2,314
    it is not off-topic…


    my tips:

    - grass is very expensive to render:
    1) the overdraw costs you a lot of fillrate
    2) grass produces a lot of draw calls
    --> 1) reduce the draw distance
    --> 2) reduce the resolution of the detail map (this tool allows to do so without loosing your work: http://forum.unity3d.com/threads/118820-TerrainEdge-3-(need-testers-feedback-ideas-etc))
    but of course: make a backup of your terrain!

    - try to use not more than 4 terrain textures

    - try to raise the number of pixel errors
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2012
  34. khorlog

    khorlog

    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    3
    Hello SevenBit,

    I think the problem lies in your config. From what you say your'e playing on a laptop, maybe with integrated graphic card and shared memory.

    If so that's really not the right setting to play such a scene.

    I did it on my old (omg I'd like to have a new one!) E6850 with 4Gb ram and radeonHD5850, and it's just moving without any problem.

    Regards
  35. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    I'm sorry, I can optimize a maximum my scene but I'm not magician. Of course if you try to run a terrain like this on a laptop with integrated graphic card I'm afraid that you will be disappointed.

    My goal, is to run this scene smoothly on my computer. I get 125 fps with water and 230 without.
    Terrain resolution is standard :

    2048/2048 /800
    hightmap resolution : 2048
    detail res: 1024
    controle texture and base texture : 1024

    Trees are optimized a lot, and I get an average of 1800 poly/tree.

    I can reduce more the polycount of trees, reduce details and grasses, use a fog to cover 50% of the scene use only 4 maps for ground texture, but the final result will never be the same :/
  36. SevenBits

    SevenBits

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2011
    Messages:
    1,956
    Hello all.

    First, about my specs. I Do Not have an integrated graphics card for my configuration. I will try and run on slightly more powerful machine, but I don't think that'll change a thing.

    The truth is, your scene is not designed to be in a web player. It's cool, I'll admit, and I had fun looking around, but it's not designed for that.
  37. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    You're right, the goal is to create an executable, not a webplayer :)
    In fact, the webplayer was made because some people asked it. Next time, I'll upload an .exe, users will be able to change settings with
    the launcher.
  38. larsbertram1

    larsbertram1

    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2008
    Messages:
    2,314
    of course you are right but:
    that is pretty high res – do you really need that accuracy? especially in y (800) direction?

    setting this to 512 will half the number of draw calls just for the foliage (may be from something around 300 drawcalls just for the grass to about 150...
    of course this won’t give you the same amount of control as far as the placement is concerned but most of the time you just do not need it. and in case you need it just place grass and foliage as game objects, assign them to a layer which you cull at a distance of let’s say 60 m: much cheaper to render!
    lowering the detail resolution will also lower the detail density but you can easily get around this by adding the same grass texture several times to the terrain.

    setting this to 512 will half the number of draw calls just for the foliage (may be from something around 300 drawcalls just for the grass to about 150...
    of course this won’t give you the same amount of control as far as the placement is concerned but most of the time you just do not need it. and in case you need it just place grass and foliage as game objects, assign them to a layer which you cull at a distance of let’s say 60 m: much cheaper to render!
    lowering the detail resolution will also lower the detail density but you can easily get around this by adding the same grass texture several times to the terrain.

    that should be absolutely ok, for not the number of tris is not the bottleneck but the fillrate (alpha testing on the leaves...)
    next to the fact that every tree forces 6 draw calls (when using real time shadows). they do not get batched.
    so planting bushes as "trees" is not a good idea. planting bushes as gameobjects is not either in case they are modeled using the tree creator as batching is not supported at all.

    setting up the terrain carefully you should end up with about 800 – 1400 draw calls max. what do you have now?

    lars
  39. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    I've made a test about y direction and changing this value affect the maximum height of the terrain but not really the number of polygons. Of course if the slope is more smooth, the subdivision if less but it's mean that I have to reduce global elevation of my world.

    Another test on a new terrain (see picture) Detail map resolution don't affect draw call, it's just the number of elements paint on the terrain. (don't look fps, they are incorrect)
    Of course with a bigger map, you can paint more details, but in my case, I use 1024 resolution to be more precise in details placement. I try to place them one by one, and for grasses, I use a very low opacity to avoid to place too much grasses in the same place.

    About draw call:

    Without water : +- 1200/1300 (with shadows and camera fx)
    With water : 1800/2400 (I have to look how to optimize this water surface)

    in unity "free" without water, shadows and cam fx: 500/800 depending of looking direction.

    Attached Files:

  40. khorlog

    khorlog

    New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    3
    However it's how I played it, and it went good...

    Fullscreen or not
  41. PrimeDerektive

    PrimeDerektive

    Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2009
    Messages:
    2,959
    fixed.
  42. jc_lvngstn

    jc_lvngstn

    Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2006
    Messages:
    1,305
    Gotta agree...it played very well for me.
  43. larsbertram1

    larsbertram1

    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2008
    Messages:
    2,314
    of course not but it might give you much more accuracy… but just in case your mountains are not 800m high.

    very special case that you have there… but have a look here: 114 vs 314 draw calls just due to the detail resolution.
    200 draw calls less for grass would give you the chance of planting about 33 more mesh trees [198 draw calls].
    if you have to place some grass very precisely add those as gameobjects: they will be batched (if dynamic batching is enabled ---> 1 more draw call for all manually added grass). although lighting will be different.

    $Bildschirmfoto 2012-02-28 um 20.02.25.png

    $Bildschirmfoto 2012-02-28 um 19.59.52.png
  44. ModernCGI

    ModernCGI

    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2011
    Messages:
    56
    All I can say is HOW DARE the humans in your world build a bridge over such a beautiful landscape!! lol jk. Great job it looks phenomenal!
  45. Jaimi

    Jaimi

    Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2009
    Messages:
    2,252
    Looks very nice! I was getting lower performance than I expected also. My guess is that you are running a bunch of post-processing effects, and you have anti-aliasing turned on as well.
  46. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    But in the second case, you have more or less 100k more poly. Of course if you use bigger resolution, when you paint details, unity place more objects (and raise draw call). My test was to place same number of details with different resolution, and my observation is that the resolution don't affect draw call. It's because that I use very low opacity brush to avoid to "saturate" area with unnecessary objects. (and I place often manually grasses, one by one)


    Don't worry they are all dead :D
  47. TylerPerry

    TylerPerry

    Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2011
    Messages:
    5,095
    Thats good :D.... as long as the apes dident take over then build another bridge :O
  48. POLYGAMe

    POLYGAMe

    Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Messages:
    185
    This looks so good it makes me want to quit game dev. LOL.
  49. botumys

    botumys

    Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Messages:
    588
    Hi, some news about my world:

    I finished to tweak trees and optimize elements. Now, I'm doing some research about the bridge (on picture, it's floating because I'm only focus on the top shape)
    And the path along the rock towards the opposite site of the lake if finished too.

    Attached Files:

    • $A20.jpg
      $A20.jpg
      File size:
      172.3 KB
      Views:
      511
    • $A21.jpg
      $A21.jpg
      File size:
      293.6 KB
      Views:
      513
    • $A22.jpg
      $A22.jpg
      File size:
      283.8 KB
      Views:
      6,796
  50. jc_lvngstn

    jc_lvngstn

    Member

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2006
    Messages:
    1,305
    Love your water shader, where did you get it?