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  1. Posts
    23
    I would definitely like to see a way one could create there own username & password, which this information is sent to the owner of the game, and people can log on and play.

    I know nothing about networking, so if anything I stated above doesn't make sense, or makes me sound like a noob, you know why.

    I'm really looking forward to the tutorial, though.


  2. Location
    Johannesburg
    Posts
    145
    1. Simple, iterative steps

    Working through the current networking sample, it took a lot of effort to separate all the bits out for a specific set of functionality.

    I want to know what the minimum amount of code is that is required to address a certain set of functionality.

    Then after I know the basics I can get properly bogged down in all the complex issues.


  3. Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    877
    1. Simple, iterative steps

    Working through the current networking sample, it took a lot of effort to separate all the bits out for a specific set of functionality.

    I want to know what the minimum amount of code is that is required to address a certain set of functionality.

    Then after I know the basics I can get properly bogged down in all the complex issues.
    That's exactly what I aimed for, I had the same problem: The unity networking tutorial is too messy; way too much code, you don't know where to look.

    My tutorial consists of several independent scenes, each with their own subject: A scene with only connecting/disconnecting, RPC, Observing(Serialisation), etc.
    Mike Hergaarden - M2H Game Studio - http://twitter.com/M2Hgames

    Unity 3D game portal: Wooglie.com
    Free Unity resources/projects M2HCulling, Networking tutorial and more


  4. Location
    Houston, TX
    Posts
    2,186
    I have been working with the internal networking (outside of my own RakNet solution) for a while now trying to track down exactly what causes this and where the fault lies, whether it is a queueing issue, a network interrupt issue, or even just an object reference issue, all this based on my initial findings as to object instansiation to network view ID loss.

    From what I have observed so far, this appears to be some sort of object reference issue. If you create a reference to a game object and associate a network view with that game object reference, this looses the view connection either immediately (within a few game loops) or over time.

    I built up the network sample and deployed it to a few hosted network servers, one being a Linux CENTOS 5 server and one being a Windows 2003 standard server, both dual processor quad core machines, plenty of power house. I have tested for 2 weeks straight on two different itterations, one itteration was the authoritative design and then on the windows 2003, I setup a game as the server on the machine that same machine, so the server is both the game server and the master server.

    Loss of network view ID is happening not by the master server itself, but within the internal client/server build inside the Unity core code. The master server is just an announcer, not doing much else at the moment. Somehow the client build is resetting the network view ID internally (sorry but I do not have access to the internal Unity code and I can't afford to buy a license to give me access).

    This is beyond the scope of user based code and is essentially a bug. As since Unity gets over 500 bug reports a day and goes through them and prioritizes them, the likely hood that this will get fixed by 2.6 is low, it is going to require someones full attention and they have to identify the reason why the id is reset to null (that is the end result, the view id is nullified, not even equal to any value), on the proceding game loop, this null is then re-instansiated to 0, so it doesn't match any synched ID with anyone else and the object is just simply lost.

    I am almost finished with a new sandbox that includes the deathcar from one of the user posted unity packages on the forums, when I am done, I will likely post a link to a download for the sandbox network game which will allow for additional testing. The server has ran with the latest beta network master server code now for a full week un-interupted, 4 clients attached 7x24 with intermittened client drops, and the only thing I see on the master server console is

    "-INFO- Removing Rows for IP ...."
    But the player machine didn't disconnect, didn't loose internet, didn't have frame delay or network delays of any kind, just poof. So this suggests that the problem is simply in the Client code portion of the network code internal in Unity. (again, sorry, beyond my financial scope of software ownership)

    The player that was dropped, can simply reconnect and get a new network view ID and play on.

    I want a more intensive test though, so as I said, the new sandbox will include the deathcar, with hopefully the turret working going to see about throwing in the remote turrets from the fps demo and if possible, also the bots. It is a flat play field with a wall surrounding it, not much of a goal, just kill or be killed and can reset to home position after death. With all this going on, hopefully the issue will show sooner than just driving around for a few days.

    Hopefully in this zero to hero thing, you will have a way to code around this problem.


  5. Location
    New York
    Posts
    16

    Zero to Hero Guide

    Hey, first. Thank you for working on this. I am actualy not a Unity Developer, just a 3D artist. But I am working on a small map where you run around and fight other people online. Problem is that I know nothing about networking and what I know about Unity I learned from this awesome tutorial on Learn Me Silly website, They covered a lot in a video tutorial that was super easy to follow. If you can manage to pull of this tutorial and make it as easy to follow as the Unity tutorials on Learn me silly. That would be awesome!

    I got a lot of stuff working but as far as putting a second player into my map from a different computer, I dont even know where to start. I have tried to look it up today but everything is so complicated, the closest I got was with a program called Smartfox? I had no idea what was doing what but tried to follow directions, how ever it dint work and because I dint know what anything did, I could not figure out how to fix it.

    Anyway, very much looking forward to your tutorial.
    I play my games too much before I finish them.


  6. Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    877

    Feedback

    I've just finished the tutorial, I only need to refine/improve the text here and there. To improve this tutorial I need some people who belong to the target group to actually use it (and proofread the tutorial).

    Are there any volunteers that want to learn about the unity networking and help refine the tutorial at the same time? Please reply here or PM me and I'll send you the download link to the PDF file and the unity project.
    Mike Hergaarden - M2H Game Studio - http://twitter.com/M2Hgames

    Unity 3D game portal: Wooglie.com
    Free Unity resources/projects M2HCulling, Networking tutorial and more


  7. Location
    New York
    Posts
    16

    Woohoo!

    I would love to test it out. I have been working day and night on this project and that is the biggest missing peace I have. I will go thru it step by step and send you feed back, man, what perfect timing.
    I play my games too much before I finish them.


  8. Location
    Vancouver Wa.
    Posts
    134
    I would also like to help. Sent you a pm with email address.
    Some learn by seeing others doing and some not at all

    3MOG (Mini Massive Multiplayer Online Game)a small developers definition of MMOG
    UnityPro iPhoneAdv


  9. Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    877
    Thanks! You and all the others who contacted me have received a PM/email with the two download links.
    Mike Hergaarden - M2H Game Studio - http://twitter.com/M2Hgames

    Unity 3D game portal: Wooglie.com
    Free Unity resources/projects M2HCulling, Networking tutorial and more


  10. Location
    Ann Arbor MI, USA
    Posts
    619
    still can apply to refine it? or is one day after your post too late?


  11. Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    877
    Sure, I've sent you a PM.
    Mike Hergaarden - M2H Game Studio - http://twitter.com/M2Hgames

    Unity 3D game portal: Wooglie.com
    Free Unity resources/projects M2HCulling, Networking tutorial and more


  12. Location
    Leiden, NL
    Posts
    14
    Ooh! I want in! I've been up to my head in networking, trying to get it right. I learned what i know so far from the little resources that are out there, including the networking example. What really bothered me is that even though the example gives you a functional project, it doesn't really explain anything or guide you through the interesting bits. So i thought about writing a tutorial like this too once i felt i would know enough. Since that apparently hasn't happened yet, i'm very interested in reading your go at it

    Also, the thing i haven't figured out yet is how to do client side prediction in Unity. It seems to me that you need more control over the engine than Unity gives you, since you would kind of need to be able to rewind the whole scene and play out some simulation steps with updated information when server updates arrive. Am i right about this? And does your tutorial cover a solution or a workaround? In any case, i'd like to contribute to the tutorial while my own trials and tribulations are still relatively fresh in memory.


  13. Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    877
    Thanks, I've send you a PM with the doc&project folder links.

    Also, the thing i haven't figured out yet is how to do client side prediction in Unity. It seems to me that you need more control over the engine than Unity gives you, since you would kind of need to be able to rewind the whole scene and play out some simulation steps with updated information when server updates arrive. Am i right about this? And does your tutorial cover a solution or a workaround?
    No you don't need more control, you can already do this in unity. The networking examples even contains an example. You can delay the multiplayer game by e.g. 100ms and therefore always know what's coming next, and use that to battle lag. Furthermore prediction is always possible by taking the last few actions into account.

    My tutorial briefly discusses prediction too, after you've read it you can have another look at the unity networking example (the interpolatednetworkXX script).
    Mike Hergaarden - M2H Game Studio - http://twitter.com/M2Hgames

    Unity 3D game portal: Wooglie.com
    Free Unity resources/projects M2HCulling, Networking tutorial and more


  14. Location
    The Netherlands
    Posts
    877
    Bump; released the tutorial to the public. Suggestions and feedback is still welcome.
    Mike Hergaarden - M2H Game Studio - http://twitter.com/M2Hgames

    Unity 3D game portal: Wooglie.com
    Free Unity resources/projects M2HCulling, Networking tutorial and more


  15. Location
    Atlanta
    Posts
    21
    I have not had a chance to realy go through the tut. but just browseing it looks great.

    Thanks for makeing this for the community. I am positive it will help me out.


  16. Location
    North Idaho
    Posts
    371
    Leepo;

    You might want to include the information that is being compiled @ this thread - it has been invaluable to me when developing advanced interpolation algorithms and tuning for minimum lag.
    Aubrey Falconer ~ of Mars Explorer & Syn3h
    i7 930 @ 3.5 Ghz, HD 5850, C300 SSD + 4 HDs, H50 cooler, HAF X encased dual boot hackintosh


  17. Location
    Brits, South Africa
    Posts
    1,780
    Quote Originally Posted by Tubeliar
    What really bothered me is that even though the example gives you a functional project, it doesn't really explain anything or guide you through the interesting bits
    This has been my exact same issue also and has made networking nothing but a mere dream for me... i am so glad I found this thread! Wow! I am going to enjoy reading this!!!

    But to jump the gun, I want to quickly ask something. I think the answer is obvious but as I have never done any networking code I think I will just come right out and ask.

    An idea I have had since 1998 is to have an arena (boxing, baseball, whatever) with a number of players participating in the event and then other people could log in and become spectators. Imagine a game like yu-gi-oh where you win the opponents cards so if you loose, you loose big. A great way to find out if you want to challenge someone is by sitting in the arena and watching him/her battle someone else.

    Now, if 1000 people want to join an active game, but they only SEE the game being played, will they still require the same amount of network traffic as the people playing the game? What about the people playing the game, can I show them the actual amount of people in the stadium or will that kill the game? What about if I load generic character models on the client side to represent the audience and only send through the audience member's name and transform? Is that viable? What I would like to do, ideally, is to have the audience be able to move around the stadium and speak to other people.

    How doable is something like this? Should I set an audience limit of like 32 or so and that is it? Can I do this for in the thousands or is this completely unpractical?


  18. Location
    Johannesburg
    Posts
    145
    From a network perspective you would want to segregate the viewers from the players, so viewers don't add lag to the player experience.

    You would have to stream exactly the same data, but for the viewer it doesn't matter if there's a bit of lag, even a couple of seconds wouldn't really matter that much.

    What you could probably do is create only one "viewing" server that would be a client of the "authorative" game server. This means that the server actually overseeing the game only needs to broadcast the status to one additional client.

    Then you could have viewer only clients connect to the viewing server, and that could almost be a whole independent game on its own.

    It would be pretty complicated, and I would encourage you to do a more straightforward networking game first, just to get a hang of unity networking. Then you can decide if you want to use unity's internal networking, or rather go for a 3rd party tool


  19. Location
    Brits, South Africa
    Posts
    1,780
    the logic seems clean. I was worried that the more spectators join the match, the more lag there is going to be between the players and the spectators would then inadvertadly cause glitches in the battle and spoil the fight...

    Imagine doing a baseball game. Each player is a live player and each one of the parents and family and friends gather on their own PCs to watch this historical first-ever online baseball match between the two great rival schools... and because the entire school is there, the lag causes the ball to skip through the bat or the bat to not swing at all... eww...

    But sending the data to another server that does this processing is an idea I have not yet thought of. Thanks for the tip. Also, I agree that I will have to start small. I was just curious about this because I have had this idea for a very long time now, just had no idea IF and IF then HOW...

    So many thanks


  20. Posts
    4
    thank you leepo for the tutorial. very helpful 5 star source.

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