3.5: First Impressions

Why do people expect to get everything for free these days? UT is a business that sells a product. If you can't/won't buy that product then you can't have the features of that product. It's that simple.

I'm sure most of us would love to drive a Ferrari. Would it be logical though to complain that they don't offer a free version of their car?

I think people should be overjoyed that UT even offer ANY version of their amazing product for free. Let alone one that has so many amazing features as it is. Try being grateful for that instead of bitching about what you're missing out on.

Sorry to rant. Those comments just really get on my nerves.

 

As expected, Demostenes is unhappy. Dude, take a week off. Then come back and with a clear head, submit your project to unity, they will not share it with any 3rd party and it could solve your problems.

 

Agreed!
There is already a lot cool stuff in the free version. At least for hobbyists it's more than enough IMHO. If you are serious about game development, Pro is it worth to invest some money.
Sure it is huge pile of money for some people. But UT employees would like to pay their bills as well. And they put a lot effort in this stuff.

 

Are the bug reports you already did well documented and updated with testcases? I am asking because in my experience with most of my bug reports, I at least got a reply and roughly half of them are fixed (well not that I did *that* many reports). Which makes me wonder why we have so much different experiences, I don't think I am special (nor am I implying anything about you).

 

Hate to sound spiteful, but is it worth upgrading to 3.5 at all? At least at its current stage, Also I am tempted to just go and use UDK on my heavy environment based game as state prior the environment system is kind of outdated.

 

Well if you are in full on production, don't upgrade but not because it's not good, but simply because it is a beta.

I have installed both, but right now, I mainly use 3.5 to fool around and see how the new things work (which I guess is the whole purpose of doing this developer preview)

 

Good to hear

I'm aware about the ways to change the default Terrain shaders. I just hope to get some more sophisticated stuff out of the box for the terrains. That would be nice.

Thanks for the explanation.

 

I wonder if that cloth rendering bug has been fixed... **daydreams**

 

+1. I like the sound of this... but for now, I will just use meshes for my terrain

 

I agree i dont think they shouldent be paid i just think its a bit steep for people who dont have money for it so there should be another option eather a profit share up to a amount or i think there should be a cheaper version with some features of unity pro but not all. i actualy wish there was still unity indie as then i think it would be more feature rich then unity free but less then unity pro(if you get my jist).

Its like the fiat motor group; fiat = unity free, Maserati = unity basic(android and ios) and ferrari = unity pro, as a fiat is basic, a maserati is quite good and a ferrari is great. Why not make a maserati(unity basic) for pc?

Or if they made four three licenses like: fiat = free, alfa romeo = basic, maserati =good ferrari = pro.

I would be happy to give UT 100% of my profits up to like $5,000 or something like that.

 

There is. It's called Unity and it's free.

And re profit share, can you seriously imagine the administrative overhead that would create for UT? How would they police it? Would you be willing to open up all of your financial records to them to establish your earnings etc? More importantly, WHY would they do it when they can simply sell their product the way they do now? What's in it for them - establishing an incredibly difficult to administer profit sharing system like you're describing?

I think people should create games using Unity. When they feel that they're really making progress, or when they start making profits from their games, they should then buy themselves Unity Pro. Easy.

 

This topic should be about Unity 3.5 first impressions; I don't think we need the 50th rehash of the age-old Unity license model argument.

--Eric

 

My first impressions were mixed its great that we now have flash builds, and its good that path finding is implimented but it is horrid that path finding is a pro only feature as its not like one could build there game then add that feature in once its relesed. i think Unity should have path finding as a free feature and flash build as a pro feature.

I think its a bad marketing move as when my game is done i would buy unity pro to port it to flash for a larger audiance but i wouldent buy unity pro to impliment path finding as i would already of had to make my own AI system. So pathfinding will not make me buy Unity Pro as having flash suport would.

Dissapointed Unity

 

When I discovered Unity some years ago the basic version of Unity had a $300 price-tag (or something). Now it is free and people still complaining.
If pathfinding would be free, you can be sure someone would complain about HDR isn't free etc.

 

Flash building isn't a Pro feature, it's a separate license (like iOS etc.). Personally, if I were in charge, I would have made pathfinding available in the free license, however honestly it's not really that essential, since pathfinding can be reasonably implemented by end users, and in fact will still have to be in some cases even for Pro users. There's no way to make it 100% generic so that it applies equally well to all games...already I see people asking about using it in racing games, which isn't reasonable.

--Eric

 

i dont think you read all the posts.

@eric5h5, so then is flash suport in the developer preview going to end or something? like after 30days or something like that, are we aloud to publish with the developers preview?

 

Yes.

Good question.

--Eric

 

First Impressions,
1. Super Fast Download
2. Had a prototype project which I've been working on running in a browser as a .swf file in the first 10 min.
3. Really Enjoyed playing around with the new particle system. Can't wait to see if you can use scripting to manipulate the parameters.
4. For some reason I had the idea that this beta includes a limited time Pro Version that could be used in the Flash contest to demo what's possible which doesn't seem to be the case.
5. No crashes so far (Running on a Mac OS X Lion 10.7.2)

on top of that I noticed a sweet deal on Rochard (game made with Unity) at the Mac Store for 2.99.

Quick Question
Does anyone working at Unity have inside info on what sort of games CEO David Helgason, Flash Lead Lucas Meijer and Senior Developer Ralph Hauwert like? You know, just in case I decide to scrap my holiday plans and make a game for the contest instead

 

I read them very well.

If you're so desperate in getting pathfinding you can either get a third party solution from the assets store, or save the money for pro.
I don't think that your moaning here will change the mind of the Unity people

 

Just installed it and threw some lines at it. So from this short experience:

I really liked tonemapping.
I think Shuriken wasn't intuitive.
Already encountered a few issues.
Feels great being able to play around with new stuff.
Altering multiple objects works, yay!
Too much baking and too few dynamic solutions.

Regarding path finding and Flash export option:

I think it's reasonable making path finding a Pro only feature as a) there are other options around as well, b) some people might overestimate its usage and primary want to play around with it but for proper usage you also have to design your game accordingly, c) as for the argumentation that it's a gameplay feature, so can shadows be (remember Thief for instance?) and d) i think the free version got a lot of love in terms of new features being added (but i think shadows are missing for 2012 in there, they could have restricted the max quality though). Obviously on a personal preference you always can add one feature and remove another one.

As i wrote in another post before i don't care about the Flash export option a lot but if you want to push it then they should have made it available for free for all. After all it's just another web publishing option. But it's a nice marketing idea to start a contest in order to get people involved and excited.

Still a happy camper, hope i will find some time on the weekend. :O)

 

My First Impressions:

• Native Client Support - free license?
• Awesome particle system - lots of tinkering and doodads
• Much faster occlusion culling baking
• LOD groups!
• NavMesh/Pathfinding works as I expected. Ran 500 agents at once started to lag but each arrived at their designated goals. Also, there should be a tutorial for this.
• Flash support - limited, some C# code needs to be written. Maybe useful for simple 2D games.
• Lion Fullscreen - Undocked panels still disappears behind it when clicked out of focus. There should be an option, Always on Top.

Understanding that this is just a preview, asset stores extensions will be broken.

 

i'll wait until its stable, since all the tutorials are ancient but im too curious, lol , i might end up downloading it soon >.> once people cool down on downloading .

 

Oh I am gratefull specialy at being one of the poor sobs that bought Unity Indie then had freeloader status imposed on me practically overnight.

 

That must suck, i kind of feel the same way i get deemed a feeloader when i have payed money for a android license.

@taumel i dont realy mind not having shadows its eazy enough to add blob shadows whenever you want and for free, my main problem is that if i upgraded to Unity Pro then i could just add shadows but there would be no point adding path finding as i would already have to make my own AI to compleat my game.

But anyway from what i hear its not verry good the pathfinding, so i guess ill just make my own AI solution

 

What i was trying to say is that every feature can be a game design related feature or just some eye candy, it depends on your design. If that's shadows, path finding or some post processing, it doesn't matter.

Btw. as for that the pathfinding isn't good, i haven't had time to look into it yet so i can't say anything about it but i would be surprised if Memon did something which sucked. Therefore i expect possible limitations more due to that it's the first implementation and that it will evolve.

Btw. why isn't there a bass boost audio filter? :O)

 

fair enough but Thief proboly used path finding for its AI

 

Yes, I will upload my 25GB project with licenced content I am not allowed to share. Idea of the year! In my bugreports there is always descripted, how to reproduce problem. I was even sending updates, when I discovered something new. Collider bug? Ignored. Shadow bug? Ignored.

 

@titanty
In the first place Thief's game design was based on hiding in the shadows and darkness.

 

hey! does anyone noticed how to import compiled SWF into native FLASH IDE?
is it possible at all?

 

@taumel Ahh ok sorry ive never played the game i just looked at a trailer.

 

the native flash ide does not support stage 3d at all does it?
You can't use stage 3d together with traditional 2D flash, they are distinct apis

 

Hm... Okay, then the question is: is it possible at all, to import the compiled SWF into FlashDevelop (or FlashBuilder) and use it as a background layer WITH standard FLASH GUI (imported there too) ?

I mean, it was possible with away3d and other native flash engines.

 

away 3d 4 or earlier? earlier ones were not stage 3d but 'standard stone age old cpu only driven' flash, with away 3d 4 they added support for Stage 3D
the majority of the 3d flash engines aren't using stage 3d but the standard 2D api and rendering it all in software

 

Only impression so far....
Tried to upgrade my present 3.4.2 project five times and Unity 3.5 crashes before it finishes.
Sent error reports each time, but have uninstalled 3.5 and gone back to 3.4.2.
I'd like to like it if I could use it.
Guess I could play around with it on a new project, if I had the time.

 

Am very happy with it so far. Using it on OSX Lion. I went ahead and updated my project. The additions/fixes to the iOS version make it worth it. It plays much better with Xcode 4 and I'm pleased that we get to use Mono 2.8.

The only issue I encountered was with a handful of models that where deep into some prefabs. I had to replace the models in the scene, but I really think this is the result of me getting prefab happy and I kind of expected it since the prefab system has changed.

Download and install went flawlessly as well as the project update. I spent maybe three hour in it last night with no crashes or issues. My game seems to run faster on both the iPhone and iPad, but that might be perception/expectation on my part... hard to tell.

All-in-all very pleased.

PS: I don't understand the issues people have with the licensing model. I think it is extremely generous compared to other tools. seriously
it blows my mind what you get for free and 1500 one time for pro is more than reasonable.

 

But we don't...it's unlikely that we'll get a Mono upgrade until 4.0. MonoDevelop != Mono.

--Eric

 

Code (csharp):

1. using UnityEngine;
2. using System.Collections;
3.  
4. public class BassBooster : MonoBehaviour {
5.    
6.     public float selectivity, gain2, ratio;
7.     private float cap;
8.    
9.     // Use this for initialization
10.     void Start () {
11.         selectivity = 70.0f;
12.         ratio = 1.0f;
13.         gain2 = 1.0f;
14.     }
15.    
16.     float saturate(float x) { return Mathf.Min(Mathf.Max(-1.0f,x),1.0f); }
17.     float Process(float sample)
18.     {
19.         float gain1 = 1.0f/(selectivity + 1.0f);
20.  
21.         cap= (sample + cap*selectivity )*gain1;
22.         sample = saturate((sample + cap*ratio)*gain2);
23.        
24.         return sample;
25.     }
26.    
27.     void OnAudioFilterRead(float[] data, int channels)
28.     {
29.         for(int i= 0; i < data.Length; ++i)
30.         {
31.             data[i] = Process(data[i]);
32.         }
33.     }
34. }

(source http://www.musicdsp.org/archive.php?classid=3)

There you go. Now go make your own filters !!

 

I want to test this, but preferably, I'd like to install this allongisde my current unity, since it's a beta and all.
Is this possible ?

 

The new particle system was the feature I was most looking forward to, but I'm not sure how I feel about it. It's better than the old one, but still feels like you have to use scripting for any advanced effect.

Will we be able to make modules of our own or expand upon existing modules?

For instance, I wanted to create some simple rockets. I made one particle system shoot particles rendered as meshes (this was nice). Then I chose to set the smoke particles on the birth sub emitter, but immediately there was a problem. I wanted a glow as well. The sub emitters will only let me have 1 particles system on birth. For the explosion I wanted 4 or 5 on death, but obviously that's not going to happen.

I was hoping for a node based system. This pseudo approach doesn't feel very intuitive nor powerful to me. Keeping track of what sub system does what is also problematic because I'm not sure how they are ordered in the particle editor. My trails are listed last, after the explosion system, when they should be listed second.

 

@Soren
Cool, i'll give it a try as soon as i find some time, thanks!

 

It's pure luck, I would say. I had four or five well documented bug reports dating back over a year, all with test cases. They were all deleted in one day (along with a lot of other people's I assume - I'm not suggesting mine were picked out) and I got a message for each indicating that since they were old, it wasn't worth checking to see if they'd been fixed, so they would just assume that they had been unless I recreated my test cases and resubmitted the bugs.

So if people are struggling to find the motivation to post new bug reports, I can completely understand that. A couple of the bugs were pretty minor and a couple were fairly important - although fortunately, I wasn't waiting on a response for any of them. Nevertheless, if you're going to take that attitude to bug reports, you can't very well complain that people don't put much effort into them.

I've also had one bug report taken very seriously in the past - which is just as well given that it was an absolutely enormous oversight, that had major ramifications. There were really only two differences between the different results I got. One was that I had a well-known client complaining regularly about the one they took seriously and the other was that it was an issue Unity probably cared about much more than some of my others.

It shouldn't really come down to corporate pressure and personal preference though, should it? If it's a bug, and it's affecting a paid customer, it should attract at least a minimum level of interest.

 

I switched to sending in my bug reports as Eric5h5, this way i'm going the safe route and they do get fixed. ;O)

 

How does that work?
Or is that sarcasm?

 

Of course it's sarcasm,
signed
Dreamora

(more jesting I assure you)

 

I don't get any special treatment. (Or if I do, I would like to know, so I can take advantage of it. )

--Eric

 

I think you received some special treatment from me... ;O)

@Soren
I like the amp and the colours it uses but can you alter them as well? Oh boy, thinking of Delitracker.

 

F***, i already love 3.5 just for the audio stuff! :O)

Sadly i have to care about christmas doodle daadle now.

 

Had some crashes, slight errors when upgrading my project.
Might wait for awhile before producing in 3.5.

Interesting thoughts. Since Free users far outnumber the Pro users, maybe they thought that they could use an extra bit of 'persuasion' to buy Pro edition. No problems though, Aron has a great 3rd party solution for my needs

 

-force-opengl command line flag crashes built applications on my machine. Anyone else see this?